How to Kill a Server

Blizzard in its infinite wisdom made the decision to turn my Alliance server, Darrowmere, into a PvE server from a PvP one. Considering that the decision came down on March 3rd, with no advance notice/warning or any attempt to poll the population it was a surprise to everyone.

The response to Bornakk's blue post (full thread here) has been mixed at best.

As part of our continued efforts to balance the World of Warcraft player population across all realms, we will be converting one of our lower-population PvP realms – Darrowmere -- to a Normal PvE realm. For players on Darrowmere, we will be offering Free Character Moves to alternate PvP realms both before and for several weeks after the conversion takes place. This will allow us to continue to support healthy communities on the realms and help new players transition easily into the community.

The conversion will take place on Tuesday, March 9, with the Character Moves opening on March 3 and lasting until April 6. Upon being converted to Normal PvE, Darrowmere will be given the “New Players” flag to ensure an influx of players over the coming weeks.

The following are the destination realms for Free Character Moves off of Darrowmere:
Alterac Mountains of the Nightfall battlegroup is an Eastern time zone realm
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/board.html?sid=1&forumId=68891

Auchindoun of the Retaliation battlegroup is an Eastern time zone realm
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/board.html?forumId=75725&sid=1

Malorne of the Vengeance battlegroup is a Central time zone realm
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/board.html?forumId=11378&sid=1

Vashj of the Whirlwind battlegroup is a Pacific time zone realm
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/board.html?forumId=36015&sid=1


Having only been on Darrowmere for a little over a year (a free transfer moved me there in the first place), coupled with the fact I play on a few different servers, I don't have the long history and huge group of in game friends many of the original players to the server have, but I do feel their loss as guilds are breaking up and the diaspora began yesterday March 4th.

Trade chat was filled with the guilds and individuals making their goodbyes and telling which server they were transferring to. It reminded me much of Fiddler on the Roof when the inhabitants are all forced to leave their home town. The goodbye's, the look me up when you get moved, the few guilds that have decided to ride it out encouraging people to stay and recruiting - it was so sad.

Reading the Server Forum was no better. As one poster stated going from PvP to PvE won't be that big of a change for end game raiding guilds, especially as with the current looking for group cross realm, the need/use of summoning stones is pretty much gone and world PvP is all but dead on most PvP servers. In general PvE servers tend to have higher populations with RP having even higher. The few PvP servers in the Whirlwind Battlegroup (Darrowmere and Vashh) are all fairly low population or heavily unbalanced Horde:Alliance rations from 1.3:1 to 4:1.

Many view PvP servers full only of the gankers or wanna be griefers, roaming Azeroth looking for lowbies to kill and corpse camping. I've been killed by those types, but in all the time I've played I've never been camped. I don't think camping is nearly as common as people believe. Not being a ganker/griefer and not always embracing the "red=dead" philosophy, I've received alot of flak from guildmates over time. Generally I leave an individual alone if they're questing, but do on occasion go on killing sprees - lol! I will defend myself or make a tactful retreat if need be... choose your battle is my philosophy!

I just liked the added tension and need to be aware when leveling/questing of the "potential" to be killed by the enemy. I mean Alliance and Horde are in opposition, so I've always found it strange to be questing 20 feet away from someone that should be an enemy to my faction. It really changes your play style if you know you might die, versus only worrying about NPC's and pulling to many mobs.

• Racing through Elwynn Forest dodging trees, being chased by a Mage and Druid team was exhilirating.
• The pirate jumping out of the bushes at me near Tarren Mills.
• My rogue guildie saving my butt in STV, while he was on a gank the opposition spree
• Locking down whole zones with the guild on a raid through Arathi Highlands
• The back and forth wars between Tarren Mills and Southshore
• Traveling through Ratchet, Booty Bay or Wintergrasp should be all about being aware!
• Everyone should experience STV on a PvP server. It's just a right of passage in many ways.

What does a rogue do on a PvE server? Kill the bank and AH NPC's? Camp the Crossroads? (my rogue is level 2 bank alt)


So with a heavy heart, last night I moved the gang to Vashj, as that was the only PST server available. My Alliance guild is still debating where to move to, and will make their decision this weekend. As half on EST/CST and half on PST it won't be an easy decision. I feel for some of them that have played together for years, as they may lose many ingame friends.

I do hope they'll chose Vashj, but thoroughly understand wanting to play on a server with a better chance at a healthy population during the time you're on than not. Why I went with the only PST server available.

The move wasn't an 'easy' choice. I did check all four options Forums and finally made an alt on Vashj. Read trade for an hour, checked the AH (better economy than Darrowmere sadly) and spoke with a few individuals. No one was very encouraging about the move as many started on Vashj and have watched their own population dwindle as people transferred off for greener pastures. Raid progession is still far behind most servers and WG is owned by the Horde 18 to 20 hours a day. Hmmm already feels like home - lol! Darrowmere has had these same problems so hopefully this change will infuse new blood into Vashj.


My last toon (Ziboo) made her way through both Stormwind and Ironforge her goodbye view (considering each serve is identical its amazing how 'different' they can feel!) It was sad as the majority of players were bands of roving Horde killing NPC's. It was a ghost town.

It really felt like the world was coming to an end - all it needed was a coyote and a few tumbleweeds to get that desolate feel.


Oh well! Here's to a fresh start on Vashj! Cheers!

PvP

I heard today that the first killing of Emperor Karl Franz in Warhammer has finally occurred.  Bravo to the guilds that completed that task.  It's no easy thing locking down the whole Tier 4 (and generally Tier 3) then taking the city and killing him. I do hope someone taped it and will put it on YouTube.  When the RvR works in Warhammer it rocks!  I've played both sides in that game but Destruction is fun, I must admit.

Back to WoW

It's been a busy few days on Darrowmere as apparently the latest round of Horde players are trying to score their bear mount (killing the city leaders), so my DK (only level 61 and a gnome to increase Horde irritation - lol!!!) out defending in Ironforge or Stormwind.  

While going from IF to SW tonight, I was in the Tram with a level 80 Horde warlock (a bit over 1/2 health) and a level 80 Alliance rogue.  (This is the typical apathy I see on many PvP servers)  I mention to the Rogue the warlock is there - kind of 'hint, hint' hiding in the corner across the tracks.  

  The player' responds.  "They aren't doing anything."

  I say, "They're raiding Stormwind and Ironforge."  

  She says, "I'm not going over to kill something."  (Confusing I know but thats what the person said.)

  I reply, "So, why do you play on a PvP?"

  "So, people like you can ask me questions."

  "Ah.  PvE oriented." 

  "Yep."

  "Well we know Rogues don't like to fight."  (I know mean but this is a PvP SERVER!!!) 

No pushing that one into PvP on a PvP server . . . no way!

So went on to Stormwind, died twice helped kill ten Horde.  The last one I was working on (and calling for backup) was a pally.  He Bubble hearthed out.  This started my bad pally karma tonight! 

The good news - the king lived!  Yesterday the same in Ironforge - it was a good 40+.  I like to make the Horde work for that bear mount, seeing as how Darrowmere has a fairly meek Alliance force - okay not just meek, but totally outnumbered, so I'll not be getting that mount on any characters unless I can figure out how to solo the leaders - lol!!!!

Arathi Highlands a few minutes later . . .

Poor Uldur (31 druid) went to get his first aid books in Arathi - two level 39 pallys questing - poor dead Uldur.  So what is this with the FA books going to be available from trainers after the 3.1 patch?  That is so bogus!  I'm really noticing the dumbing-down of WoW and empathizing from the pre-BC crowd.  How easy does this have to get?  Start at level 79, heres 25K gold, everything you need to buy is from this guy here and you don't really need to move the xp will just come to you?  

Back on topic!

More pally PvP fun . . .

After that I dinked around with a few characters, cleaned out the bank, and finally hopped on Sithi to do a bit more towards her ever seeing 80.  A few quests completed with no Horde interference killing some guys, then off to Colderra.  Neat area, was exploring around when a bored level 80 pally spotted the toy of the day - Sith and Holiday!  Down Holiday goes as the pally sits there.  I shoot, trap and run.  He chases, judges and toys.  Even when I pull another mob he just keeps up being a PIA.  I continue shooting him, pointedly ignoring the mob.  Half alive by now, trap mob, run.  He chases again, traps up toss it behind me.  Trap the pally on his horse - lol - wish I'd been faster on the screen shot for that.  Now he's a bored and mad level 80 pally - so chases me - shadowmeld - pops me out.  Trap again - really unhappy pally.  Run around hill, he follows, run around again - laughing now as this is getting comical - he finally goes airborn to find me - lands and kills me.  I hope he enjoyed himself - as I hate pallys on a hunter!

Rez and rez Holiday.  Back to health and time to leave as there are now 4 Horde in the area, all level 80.  Of course the next one takes his shot as I'm hearthing out.  I aggro the guards as he's in a building (I guess he's done this before) so, the guards kill me (hope he didn't get honor for that one!)  Wait and rez again, then out.

This reminds me of the first time through Outlands while all the then bored 70's lurked around Hellfire to make life miserable for the freshly through the portal crowd.  3.1 should make Northrend bearable for a few days at least.

I finally logged out, took a break.  Then jumped back on her.  We went to find Thassarian.  (I personally love the DK start area - and have done it I think 6x, so finding him was cool!) We're now doing some quest for him using his ghoul.  That will have to keep for another day though - its late!!!

PvP Rant

Why do people play on PvP servers yet never PvP?  I'm not talking arenas or BGs as those are available for all servers.  I'm talking actual player vs player?  I'm not even meaning the ganksquads or ones that thrill on killing someone 20 levels lower than them. 

But if you're on a PvP (or PvE server for that matter) when your city/town is under attack, why do so many people totally ignore it?  I'm not saying drop whatever you're doing and ride in like the white knight, but sitting on your latest and greatest mount or showing off the newest armor set piece in Org or Stormwind and absolutely not taking advantage of World PvP when its presented - I don't get it!  

It's handed to you!  They're there to kill your king or inconvenience everyone by - heaven forbid - taking out the auctioneers, flight masters and bankers - so why not fight back?  Are all the level 80's that jaded and it's just to boring to bother?

Why be on a PvP server if PvE raiding is all people do?

What I see (and don't generally get) is the group that will PvE kill npc's - how thrilling - in Westfall or Crossroads, but run if any opposition shows up!  I had assumed (bad word that ass out of u and me word!), they did this with the goal of drawing out the higher levels to defend/pvp, but if you run away - I guess beating up the npcs was all they intended to do.  Getting there jollies that way - ???? 

I don't get it.  I'm pretty 'quest and let quest' mentality generally in not actively killing or seeking PvP when someone is obviously out questing.  Especially when they're doing escort quests - its oh so tempting at times - but I've been killed right near then end of one those and what a pain to escort those stupid chickens again!    

But if you're close to town, ganking lowbies or being a pest  . . . you die or I die trying to kill you!

What is PvP?

As the title says it - What is PvP?  

Technically we could say any player to player action (including trading, grouping, buying/selling, duels, chatting, etc.) is PvP.  BUT we all tend to think of PvP as the act of combat with another player or players.

Now we get to the crux of the problem, defining PvP in the context of combat.  

The Old School, "we've been gaming since people threw stones at each other - ugh ugh - therefore 'our' knowledge is vast and  . . .  type", will often loudly and abusivly state that PvP only exists in games such as Ultima Online (UO) or Dark Ages of Camelot (DA0C) or and sandbox-type game that allows player driven/inspired/controlled PvP.  Anything else is weak and pathetic or unworthy of being classes as PvP.  

I often read on forums and other blogs that if it's not full on looting and/or with massive death penalties when you lose a fight it doesn't count.  Anything else is carebear or isn't 'real' pvp or just for nub/scrubs.

The opposite side is the whining in most games from those that just got ganked, about the unfairness of it all.  You did roll on a PvP server right?  Well then stfu!  I accept the risk of playing on a PvP, and do go from gleefully happy when I win, to angry time to log when I've played poorly or been killed numerous times (ala Hillsabrad on a bad day!).

The debate rages even within a specific game -

  WoW has the never-ending argument about PvP -  is it arena's (what's your rating hmmm?) or battlegrounds or only world engagements actual PvP? 

  Warhammer has the same problem in 'are scenarios ruining the RvR or are scenarios legitimatePvP'?

Personally, I enjoy battlegrounds/scenarios - they're defined areas, defined goals, everyone knows why they're there and it is a competition - albeit sometimes quite uneven in numbers, skills, etc.  But the fact that everyone there is there for the reason of fighting makes the rules simple and understandable - kill or be killed period!  No one can complain if 20 guys mow you down, duh why'd you stand in the road?  All classes abilities can be used, althoug some scenarios/bgs favor certain abilities (ranged vs melee).

Do I think the BGs/SC's could be dramatically improved -yes!  I didn't have the opportunity to try the pre-BC battlegrounds, and think adding questing, more goals, a bit of pve stuff in Alteric Valley would breathe life back into them.  The saving grace with Warhammer's scenarios - they're timed.  You know win/lose its all done in 15 minutes.  If you want longer protracted fights - there is the RvR lakes with the mix of pvp/pve.

The RvR lakes are fun when actual PvP is happening (versus PvE taking undefending keeps).  Epic battles with 3 warbands on each side are all out mayhem and quite exhilirating!  

The reason I prefer structured PvP is, I have a hard time (as much as I love world PvP) killing someone that I can clearly see is out questing, etc., or basically minding their own business.   If you're near our towns, cities or areas you don't belong I'm going to kill you if I can, send out a request for help if I can't!

But, I've tried and have a hard time trying to embrace the 'red is dead' mentality!  I can't take it to heart.  I've been on world guild raids when we're killing everything in our path (those are fun!), but I like a fair fight and will defend myself even if a much higher level is killing me, I'm going to put up whatever fight I can!!!  

I just don't get a whole lot of joy to gank someone many levels lower than me!  I have done that, but rarely.  My shadow priest once dotted 3 guys 20 levels lower.  I'm not sure if they noticed but it was funny watching them fall over dead - lol!  I felt bad about it later, but it was funny.

A gnome one time hiding by our graveyard in Warsong Gulch dotted us as we're rezzed  . . . none of us noticed until we fell dead before we were midfield.  Finally someone did and we killed him.  I'm sure he had a huge laugh over that.  It is funny in hindsight!

Admittedly though, nothing is sweetier though then beating the guy who tried to kill you - especially if its two or more of them!!!  I had a pally/rogue duo attempt to take out my death knight one day in Un'Goro.  I was leaving them alone, but they felt the need to try and kill me.  Oh well.  It was really fun watching them run every time after that they saw my little gnome on the horizon - lol!!!

I was very happy the day my hunter developed a good strategy to deal with death knights.  I don't always win, but I'm not in the 'oh crap a DK headed my way' mode anymore!  Pallys - argh!!  I know I'm going down and running doesn't help!

My attitude is so different from many people I do play with friends, family, guildmates, as they will ride halfway across Azeroth to kill someone.  I've done that but generally as payback only!  You gank me, I'm going to try to grief you into logging out - lol!!   A mage attacked me on Hellfire one day, killed him 3x, then chased him and killed him again.

I did a brief stint through AoC (Age of Conan) when it came out on a full pvp server.  Basically you're flagged all the time.  It was fun in general as you didn't know if the guy next to you might all of sudden take a swing at you.   I even rolled on the racial based (forget the name know) where the three races were pitted against each other.  It was interesting, except for the fact we could be in the same guild, yet grouping I could kill their race, they couldn't heal me - weird.   The bad part (for me) was the roving bands of gankers looking for easy targets - usually a solo player or many levels lower.  That mentality I just don't get!  But then again I don't get human gang mentality picking on one person either.   Not very sporting to have 4-20 players whack one guy!

I've also tried PvP on EQ2.  Well I've not dinged 20 yet as I'm a basic chicken in that game.  I keep wanting to give it a really good try, but I have been playing EQ2 so infrequently as it is, I would just be dead - alot!   The people that play PvP with the way you can lock xp, just cause he's a 18 doesn't make him a 'real' 18!

LoTRO's PvMP (player vs monster player) is alot of fun.  It's a separate zone called the Ettenmoors. were you either play your own level 40 character called a freep (free person) when in the Ettenmoors zone. Or you play the evil side a monster or commonly called a creep.  Playing a creep is available at your level 10.  You start with a level 50 creep.   You can skill up by PvP, there are quests you can complete, objectives that can be taken, ganking going on, all in a rather pretty LoTRO backdrop.

It is different but entertaining.  Playing a worg or uruk'ai really brings out the urge to kill the good guys - lol!!!

If I could be queen and have the perfect PvP game -

1. Everyone is flagged at all times except for the start zone
   
2. There are zoned level differences as far as killing goes - 4 level up to level 20,  10 up to 40, free for all after that
   
3. You can not be killed while taking/turning in a quest - 30 second immunity
4. City guards have high aggro range and are epic+3-4 people to kill them not killable by a solo person
   
5. Townspeople if they see/detect the opposition will react and guards will come
   
6. Looting partial with 60-80% of goods/money only or random stuff drops into a chest/gravestone
   
7. Mercenaries (npcs or pcs) could be hired to guard you on the main roads
   
8. Killing your own kin/race, etc., would class you as a rogue available for higher xp/rewards for killing the rogue
   
9. Wanted posters could be offered for gankers
   

Anyway, now that Darkfall is out and full PvP loot is back in action, the early reports have been pretty positive.   I'm giving it a month to smooth out some of the wrinkles.  The aches and pains of AoC and Warhammer have made me a bit cautious.  I'm not sure I get Darkfall, the game as a concept so we'll see if it stays in the game rotation or not!  I understand the skill versus level base, but I guess I'm more objective based.  The objective to just run around and kill others will eventually become boring - I would think.  More research is needed apparently!!!

Done rambling . . .  GAWD that was disjointed!!!